WW 10 - Places & Spaces: Thriving in third spaces
Christina Herbach on how to cultivate positive friction, community and physical & digital integration in retail
Hello & welcome to the next edition of Wellwatching, an exploration of the evolving business and culture of wellness by me, Alex Grieves. If you’re new, have a read through previous interviews here. This is the second edition of our Places & Spaces series, in which we take a look at the places and spaces - both physical and digital - that help us feel well.
My next Places & Spaces conversation features the insightful Christina Herbach, an Executive Strategy Director at Landor & Fitch who specializes in innovation strategy, experience design, and the store of the future. Previously, she cut her teeth at Kurt Salmon, Accenture Strategy, and Bow & Arrow. Outside of her 9-to-5, she shares insights and inspiration via Cream of the Shop, a newsletter dedicated to celebrating the world's most innovative and exciting stores and the stories behind them.
We discussed the importance of ‘third spaces’ to our collective wellbeing, especially as they shape-shift in the wake of Covid-19, including: the integration of physical & digital elements; positive friction; designing for thriving communities; the store as media channel; and the second-tier city renaissance.
Tell me a bit about yourself: What do you do, and how did you get here?
I’ve recently made the jump to Landor & Fitch, where I’m helping build business design and innovation practice. I started out in marketing analytics consulting for retailers and consumer packaged goods companies, and while I enjoyed the quantitative big data side of solving problems, I was also curious about the human, design-led aspect of these issues, so I went back to graduate school and got an MBA and a Master’s in design.
After graduating, strategy consulting felt like the best way to use both of my skills. I’ve always loved industries that revolve around physical spaces and the interactions that are fostered there - between people, communities and brands. That led me to focus on retail and innovation. I find it fun to play with the balance of commercial and creative needs in these spaces, as well as how to get physical and digital elements to ‘play well’ together.
How do you think people want to interact with brands and products today - and how has that shaped what they want and expect from the retail experience?
I've been thinking about this question a lot, including the tension between negative and positive friction. What I'm seeing is that broadly speaking, customers operate in two different modes. In one mode, they want pure frictionless convenience: it’s when they turn to Amazon, need something in a few hours, don’t want to leave their flat, or seek instant gratification. In this mode, all friction is bad friction – they want things to be as smooth as possible.
In another mode, people are actively looking for positive friction. They want to explore different options at their leisure; they want to be entertained or educated. They seek a place where someone has a real curatorial eye and is going to expose them to things that they haven’t seen before from an algorithm. They’re looking for social interaction as they take in the beautiful lighting, the heft of silverware, the taste of a good meal.
Retailers tend to align with one or the other, though there is of course a role for both. Especially now, I think amping up the exploratory element of physical retail spaces is so important and magical. It opens up people's worlds, letting them linger and engage in something a bit more relaxed. It’s why, for example, so many coffee houses lowered their counters, so that caffeine enthusiasts can really take in the experience while they are waiting for their latte. People love the theatre and the discovery.
Are there any interesting ways in which you think retail trends are manifesting within the health and wellness space specifically? What are you most interested in at the moment?
There’s a growing and evolving use of retail outlets as community-oriented ‘third spaces,’ which is related to wellness. For example, Vans has created skateparks and hosts private events. Selfridges offers yoga classes - including classes that are suitable for kids. Rapha organises group cycling rides every weekend that start and end at their clubhouses.
When IKEA opened in China, they offered free coffee and ended up with the delightful ‘problem’ of seniors and retirees visiting the store in droves every weekend. They would hang out all day, sip their free coffees, and socialize on couches and at the kitchen table displays.
Examples like these are really important when we consider that we’re facing one of the biggest wellbeing crises – that of loneliness – while at the same time we continue to optimize experiences for individual convenience. As we’ve discussed, there’s a time and place for convenience, but how many people are desperately searching for community, or even just the serendipity of meeting someone at a bar? Where are the spaces for that? Using third spaces as community spaces isn’t a new concept, but I think it’s especially interesting now as we navigate ongoing Covid-19 social restrictions with varying degrees of comfort. I’m waiting to see how much we crave leaving home and returning to these third spaces, retail or otherwise, versus permanently reacclimating to certain experiences at home.
As people continue to be more conscious about their wellbeing beyond the immediate concerns of Covid-19, I think we will see retail considerations shifting from the perspective of hygiene – ‘how do I feel safe in this space?’ – back to one of fulfillment – ‘how do I thrive in this space?’
There’s a quote by Gary Friedman, the CEO of Restoration Hardware, that I love. He says, “most retail stores are archaic, windowless boxes that lack any sense of humanity. There’s generally no fresh air or natural light; plants die in most retail stores.”
As physical retail spaces recover and evolve, this is a great litmus test. If a plant can’t survive in this space, how can we expect a human to? And going further, how can people experience community in that space? How can they truly feel better leaving a space or experience, than they did before walking in?
The QR code seems to have been retail’s surprise MVP during the worst of the Covid-19 pandemic. What’s your take on them?
Given that the thread of Covid-19 continues to be very present in most parts of the world, QR codes are playing a key role in ensuring that customer experience is both easy and safe.
That said, you're talking to someone who loves the romance of the physical world. I often think back to my favourite restaurant in New York, which is situated in a converted tailor’s shop and features menus sat on wooden boards, held in place with straps that replicated suspenders – almost like pieces of art. I think it's hard to replicate the pleasure of these details – the feel of the letterpressed menu, the smell of the leather binding – with a QR code.
As the era of ‘Living With Covid’ matures, I think hybrid experience designs will need to accommodate different customer missions and comfort levels. For example, I think we won’t lose beautiful chalkboards or rich leather bound menus, but we’ll also continue to use technology like QR codes when they make sense.
What do you think is currently wrong with retail? How do you see the business model changing?
Retail is experiencing a real moment of reckoning. The mental image that comes to mind is a forest fire that clears out the deadwood and allows for new growth and ultimately a healthier ecosystem. I think what we're seeing right now is the embers of a big forest fire that's been burning for the past decade, but also the shoots and promise of new growth.
To be fair, it’s really hard to be a retailer right now. There's a squeeze from both sides.
On the one hand, big companies like Amazon can sell products at a loss and undercut competition thanks to profitable advertising/media businesses and other revenue streams. On the other hand, the market is flooded with Millennial-friendly, venture capital-backed D2C businesses that can fill interesting niches without needing to be profitable either.
Traditional retailers are stuck in the middle. They’ve spoken about the concept of ‘omnichannel’ for a long time, but haven’t yet fully realised its potential. A lot of businesses still treat their physical and digital footprint separately. They can even be in competition with one another; if someone buys a product online, for example, but returns it in store, it hits stores’ P&L.
With so much competition, it’s a great opportunity for retailers to think about the evolving role of the store, now that everything can be explored, learned about, and bought online.
This is where a true omnichannel approach can get interesting. Rather than thinking about stores simply as a sales channel, I think they should be thought of more as a media channel. If you consider in-store footfall as impressions, stores have the power to be far more immersive and effective media channels than, say, TV or print advertising. Even the best online content or slickest user experience can’t replicate the personal education, interaction and community that a store can offer its customers.
We as an industry need to think about how we reimagine the high street and its retail spaces to become societal hubs again, not just destinations for economic transactions. My hope is that in the wake of shuttered storefronts, we rethink the potential of these spaces and reimagine how we best use them.
How do you think retail can help make health & wellness solutions more accessible (in a financial, cultural, convenience sense) for more people?
It’s a big and tricky challenge, and one that isn’t helped by legacy infrastructure and ways of working. That said, I think that businesses and consumers alike are finally waking up to the idea that there are sizable populations in the UK, US and elsewhere, who have the spending power and the buying appetite, but have been traditionally excluded from retail due to their location, physical ability, and/or socio-economic status.
We’re realizing that yes, there are better ways to create more inclusive societies that are also commercially viable. Last-mile delivery services, mobile retail and pop-ups are really interesting ways of mobilising the store and allowing for access, experimentation and new experiences. The best examples of this is how we’re mitigating food deserts, expanding the physical footprint of public libraries, and using dark kitchens to introduce food concepts to new areas.
From a digital perspective, it’s also a media conversation. Media agencies are grappling with how to manifest diversity and inclusion approaches in their targeting strategies for brands. The question evolves to how you target people beyond what you think of as your ‘core’ target audience and dig deep to understand where your potential audience could be. It’s not just about more reach, but about making more of an impact with a more nuanced approach. It’s a self-fulfilling prophecy: if you only target that really narrow persona or customer group, you'll never know the potential of the other groups.
Looking ahead to the next five years, what trends are you most interested in?
I'm interested to see how cities change and evolve in response to Covid-related shifts but also longer-term trends towards urbanisation. It’s an urban planning question as much as it is a retail one. How will our cities reorganize themselves to cater to decentralised working models, and how will our third spaces evolve to create community and experiences in new ways? For example, we’re already seeing traditional retail reducing their footprint in city centres and moving further out to be closer to residential spaces.
I’m also thinking about the role of people and place in our individual well-being. I love the view of my friend who is a community architect: she challenges the interpretation of ‘self-care’ on a purely individual level. Rather, she sees self-care as something that can only be achieved at the intersection between a healthy person, community, and environment – the health of one is predicated on the health of the others; it’s interconnected. To that end, I’m interested in how shifts in urban planning, commercial real estate development, and retail concepts can contribute to making things like local produce, vertical farming and public services more accessible and sustainable.
Beyond major urban centres, I’m interested in the renaissance of second-tier cities. Will they make large urban hubs less essential? Will we return to more intimate communities? I think we might see some seismic rebalancing.
What has your biggest wellbeing breakthrough been over the past year?
Definitely getting into running and cycling. Growing up, I never considered myself an athletic person and didn’t seriously pursue any sports. When we were first locked down in the UK, however, the only thing we could do was walk or run. I tried running, initially out of desperation, and by pure force of habit it started to feel amazing. At the same time, I got into cycling as a means of adventure and escape. My partner and I cycled out of London to explore and feel free - safely - even under the most suffocating circumstances.
What does wellbeing mean to you?
For me, well-being means waking up with a smile on the weekends, having a cup of coffee, making pancakes and reading the paper in bed.
It sounds so simple, but I think these quotidian rituals are essential. It’s the combination of regular sleep, a balanced diet and connection to community – but also intellectual stimulation. What I’m reading, observing in the world and talking about with people nourishes me in so many ways.
Find out more about Christina, and explore Cream of the Shop on Instagram or via the newsletter.
Know anyone who would be the perfect interviewee for Places & Spaces? Feel free to send me a DM or an email. Thanks!